This week we have hippos with hidden bits, hearts that take a mechanical detour, and a medical case study that will make you sit down and reconsider every life choice that led you to having a body. Showcasing the very best of when science is equal parts fascinating and deeply inconvenient. We are talking population control in zoos, post surgery brain fog, and a man whose internal plumbing was re-routed in the most unhelpful way possible.
The Great Hippo Castration
Yes, hippo castration is a real thing that people have to do, and yes, it is as awkward as it sounds. Zoos sometimes castrate male hippos to manage breeding and reduce aggression, because a full sized hippo with a bad attitude is basically a small tank with feelings. The problem is hippo anatomy is not designed for human convenience. Their testes are internal, which means you cannot just locate them and get on with your day. It is more like trying to perform surgery on a moving target that is hiding inside a very large, very grumpy animal.
The procedure is often modelled on equine castration, but the scale and complexity are next level. And while the goal is practical, fewer surprise babies and fewer violent male standoffs, it is hard not to appreciate the absurdity of it all. Somewhere out there is a vet whose job description includes locating internal hippo testes, and honestly that person deserves a medal and a long holiday.
Pump Brain and the Mystery of the Post Surgery Fog
From hippos to hearts. During some cardiac surgeries, patients are put on a heart lung bypass machine, meaning a pump temporarily takes over the job of circulating blood. It keeps you alive, which is a strong selling point, but it comes with a strange side effect some patients report afterward. A temporary dip in cognitive performance, often nicknamed pump brain.
It is not usually permanent, but it can be noticeable. People describe feeling foggy, slower, less sharp. The big question is why. Is it the machine itself. Is it the stress of major surgery. Is it tiny changes in blood flow, inflammation, or oxygen delivery. Nobody has a neat answer yet, which is annoying, but also classic biology. The body is a system of systems, and it does not love being put on pause and restarted.
Sperm Where It Should Not Be
We finish with the segment that makes every listener cross their legs in sympathy. A man developed a rectal urethral fistula, meaning an abnormal connection formed between the urinary tract and the rectum as a result of a previous surgery. In plain terms, his plumbing created a back channel, and sperm ended up taking a route it was never meant to take. The suspected cause was a catheter complication during a hospital stay while he was in a coma, brought on by a cocktail of cocaine and PCP, because of course it was.
It is a wild story, but it comes with a very practical takeaway. Bodies are fragile, medical devices are serious business, and embarrassment is a terrible reason to avoid a doctor. If something is wrong, get it checked, because the alternative is becoming a case study that strangers discuss on a podcast.
So that is the week. Hippos, hearts, and human anatomy doing something it absolutely should not do. Stay curious, stay sensible, and if you learn nothing else from this episode, let it be this. Your body has no loyalty to dignity.
CHAPTERS:
00:00 Hippo Castration Study
05:50 Why Zoos Castrate Hippos
08:11 Internal Anatomy Surprise
13:04 Surgery Method and Timing
15:14 Recovery and Blood Sweat
17:12 Aftereffects and Social Dynamics
18:11 Science Communication Pivot
18:46 Alcohol Messaging Study Setup
SOURCES:
Rosetta scientist Dr Matt Taylor apologises for ‘offensive’ shirt
Astonishing Spinosaur Unearthed in The Sahara Is Unlike Any Seen Before
There's One Simple Method to Lower Alcohol Intake, And It Works
Westbury, C., & Hollis, G. (2019). Wriggly, squiffy, lummox, and boobs: What makes some words funny? Journal of Experimental Psychology: General, 148(1), 97–123. https://doi.org/10.1037/xge0000467
https://people.howstuffworks.com/why-poop-and-wiggle-are-funny-words-according-to-science.htm?
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S000169182600171X
https://futurism.com/health-medicine/exercise-cardio-stress-research
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0093691X13004275
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[00:00:00] Rod: So I'm gonna read you a snippet from a 2014 edition of the Globally Laed Journal. Theriogenology. For the two of you listening outta the 9 million. Who dunno. It's a journal for researchers, practitioners, clinicians, and industry professionals that aims to cover animal reproductive physiology, management, and bio technologies. So just snippets from the abstract. 'cause nothing is more riveting in a podcast than a a, an academic journal. Abstract. Just a snippet. In a prospective clinical surgery study, we report here for the first time in detail on the surgical castration of 10, captive adult male common hipot, AKA hippopotamus, amphibious.
[00:00:45] Not to be confused with the pygmy hippopotamus, the other kind, the successful procedures, they go on a, a species specific modification of standard equine castration techniques provide valuable insights into the spatially dynamic nature of the common hippopotamus. Testes castration of individual males not only facilitates population control, but can potentially also be employed to limit inter male aggression.
[00:01:15] So from reading this work, I quickly discovered that castrating a hippo way harder than I realized when we used to talk about it in high school.
[00:01:36] Will: It is time for a little bit of science. I'm will grant. From the Australian National University.
[00:01:44] Rod: What do you do there?
[00:01:45] Will: I do some stuff there.
[00:01:46] Rod: You're very good at
[00:01:46] Will: Yes.
[00:01:47] Rod: Yes. I'm Rod Lambert. No longer of the Australian National University, but I am a 30 year veteran of science communication and I have the mind of a teenage boy as I will continue to prove.
[00:01:57] Will: I confess that I was thrown having never thought about the difficulties of hippo castration before, but for
[00:02:03] Rod: what kind of high school did you go to
[00:02:05] Will: today? Listener as well as Hippo castration. We also have a little bit of science communication.
[00:02:11] We have, uh, well, some unexpected medicine that is a question from a listener.
[00:02:16] Rod: , And also I'll tell you about how the symptoms of a rectal urethral fistula are even weirder than you thought. Oh, you're welcome. You're welcome.
[00:02:22] Will: Okay. Okay. I I do confess. I had not, you have not, I had not pondered the logistics, the need, the, any of the, any of Hippo castration. Like someone had said to me, how do you castrate a hippo, I would've gone Okay.
[00:02:39] With great
[00:02:39] Rod: difficulty oscillate.
[00:02:40] It's TA lot.
[00:02:40] Will: Nice. Um, I, that's a different, I I would, I would assume there's, there is a way, I mean,
[00:02:46] Rod: scissors in a big hammer. Not in that order. Maybe the other way round. Oh, no, no. We discussed it at length when I was, you know, in later high school we're like, so
[00:02:57] Will: high school in Canberra in the eighties,
[00:02:58] Rod: Yeah. We're like, it's probably pretty easy to castrate a hippo.
[00:03:00] And we're like, yeah, fuck it. I said, really? It must be So it turns out
[00:03:04] Will: just, just to, just for the record
[00:03:05] Rod: it's not easy. Yeah. Um, yeah,
[00:03:07] Will: I mean, li listeners will wanna know,
[00:03:09] Rod: they will
[00:03:10] Will: appendage size, you know, how different animals, as, as we spoke recently, that the humans are actually pretty good amongst the primates
[00:03:16] Rod: are lengthy and
[00:03:17] Will: if by lengthy and girthy, that is good.
[00:03:19] But anyway, yes. Um, hippos, where do they stand in the,
[00:03:25] Rod: well, look, I don't wanna ruin the surprise, but a description of their penises is, they call 'em discreet penises.
[00:03:30] Will: Oh, okay.
[00:03:31] Rod: AKA non-visible.
[00:03:32] Will: Yeah. Well, okay. Well, yeah, well indeed, like a library discreet, you
[00:03:37] Rod: Yes. Like a library. Exactly. That's how they're often described, even in this journal, the library, like Penis of the hippo. We've heard it a thousand times. And the, well, I'll, I'll get into the, uh, testicular business because it kind of features quite highly in this story. So it turns out hippos and zoos really like to bang.
[00:04:00] Will: Sure.
[00:04:01] Rod: Like their butter, bing butter, boom, bang, bang, bang. They do it a lot.
[00:04:04] Will: Does. That's, I mean, there are, there are certainly other animals in the zoo
[00:04:08] Rod: Yeah. They don't bang them. No. Only, only other
[00:04:10] Will: they don't wanna bang in the zoo. Like, like pus for example. You put the boys and girls together, they're like, oh, seen them. I, you know, where's
[00:04:16] Rod: I don't want it.
[00:04:16] Where's the challenge?
[00:04:17] Will: where, where's some strange, I a
[00:04:19] Rod: percent. And like, and the pandas are like, well, I have a season, and so do you. And they never coincide. What? So I'm not interested.
[00:04:27] Will: Smart, smart species.
[00:04:29] Rod: being a boy and having a season. It's like, oh,
[00:04:31] Will: I'm a summer, I'm a summer router.
[00:04:33] Rod: It's like I do have a season.
[00:04:34] It's called Awake.
[00:04:35] Will: Oh, nice. Look at you.
[00:04:37] Rod: terrible. Men are terrible. We know
[00:04:38] Will: have to go there, man. You didn't have to.
[00:04:40] Rod: Well, men are terrible. Well, men, humans. So, yeah. So hippos, they, they like to get down and busy at the, at the zoos.
[00:04:47] Will: good on
[00:04:48] Rod: Yeah, fair
[00:04:48] Will: I mean, I, I got, gotta confess if I'm gonna the zoo. Yeah.
[00:04:51] Rod: Yeah. That's why you're going,
[00:04:53] Will: that's why I'm going. That's what I, I want.
[00:04:55] Rod: can we watch the hippos bang again?
[00:04:57] Will: just,
[00:04:57] Rod: like, no, I
[00:04:58] Will: would, I would feel the hippos going for it is impressive. Like it's, uh,
[00:05:01] Rod: think it'd probably be horrifying and scary.
[00:05:04] Will: Don't get caught between them. You know, the hippo hippos, of course, are the world's murderous creatures.
[00:05:08] Rod: Like they're pretty
[00:05:09] Will: mosquitoes, hippos, then humans or, so I think, I think, don't quote that one.
[00:05:13] Rod: Hippos do kill a lot of humans. Pound for pound.
[00:05:16] Will: No, not pound for pound. 'cause they're heavy mosquitoes. Pound for pound a lot more.
[00:05:19] Rod: That's true. But they don't kill 'em the same way as a hippo does. No, because that'd be horrifying. So also, hi hippos as a species are renowned. You know, they, they, they're heavily Catholic. What? So if they have the roots, then they have to have the child. Oh, they're traditional. That
[00:05:35] Will: We, we, we, they're traditional.
[00:05:37] Rod: Oh.
[00:05:38] Will: Oh, well, not like, say Bonobos. I think Bonobos.
[00:05:41] Rod: Oh. They root everything that moves. And then
[00:05:43] Will: they're for greeting, not for, not for procreation
[00:05:45] Rod: necessarily.
[00:05:45] Yeah. They're just like, I'm bored. What about you wanna root? Yep.
[00:05:48] Will: rate very high. Sure. I mean, hippo, I mean, are we hippos are endangered though, aren't they?
[00:05:53] Rod: Not in zoos. Not
[00:05:54] Will: Not in zoos.
[00:05:56] Rod: But it is a good question that comes up.
[00:05:57] It's like, why would you wanna castrate a hippo? It's like, well, in zoos, if you got them there, a female can live for 40 years and they may have 25. Okay. Calves
[00:06:05] Will: and then 25 times 25
[00:06:07] Rod: Yeah. Yeah. That's a lot
[00:06:09] Will: Yeah, we, yeah. Lot of hiplet. Yeah, but they're cute.
[00:06:12] Rod: Oh, when they're little, they're
[00:06:14] Will: Well, then you just, you know, make,
[00:06:15] Rod: what was it called?
[00:06:16] Mo tangle? Mo wee wee,
[00:06:18] Will: Uh, a
[00:06:19] Rod: one a
[00:06:19] Will: you Yeah, no, I know, I know. It wasn't even a few, it wasn't
[00:06:22] Rod: oo or something.
[00:06:22] Will: Yeah, it definitely had an eminent, um, oh. Come, come to us for your pop culture, Miguel meme. Uh, you could, you could give KPOs out for the kids. Like you could like come to the zoo, get a, get a free hippo.
[00:06:37] Free hippo. Parents would love that.
[00:06:39] Rod: You might, you just flush 'em down the toilet when they get too
[00:06:40] Will: old. I think that's what you do. Yeah. Then they end up in the Murray-Darling basin.
[00:06:43] Rod: You see the plumber going, oh my god, if I have to unblock another toilet full of hippos. So anyway, apparently, um, hippos take up a lot of space and they really like to eat. Yes. So that makes having lots of them a problem. Yeah. In your, in your defined environments.
[00:06:58] Will: not, you don't have the whole African Savannah don't in a zoo. You've got, uh,
[00:07:02] Rod: Or an entire river that's in Africa. The Ganges,
[00:07:07] Will: um, no
[00:07:09] Rod: Mississippi
[00:07:10] Will: again, no Nile. That is in Africa. I, I, I dunno if that's where the hippos are, but No,
[00:07:17] Rod: I think they're Nile hippos. They're Nile hippos. So, apparently so. Look, you just nip the old beanbag away. Problem solved.
[00:07:23] Will: Just nip the old beanbag
[00:07:25] Rod: Yeah. Oh. There's an added bonus for castration, which is the, the zoo boys who have the balls tend to wanna beat the shit out of each other.
[00:07:33] Will: What?
[00:07:33] Rod: What? Well, the zoo hippos, they've got balls and they're
[00:07:35] Will: Oh, no. So not, not the, not the the workers. Not the human
[00:07:38] Rod: Oh. They get angry too. Like you work in a zoo, you shovel shit all day. You get a bit mad.
[00:07:41] Will: you were gonna say
[00:07:42] Rod: You wanna beat an
[00:07:43] Will: they're swinging the hippo balls at each other or something like that.
[00:07:45] I don't know. Okay. No. So
[00:07:49] Rod: the three season
[00:07:49] Will: Hip hippo boys, uh, have a bit of aggression between each other. They get
[00:07:53] Rod: the str And so, um, should
[00:07:55] Will: we call 'em hippo men at this point? Because I
[00:07:57] Rod: but they are men by
[00:07:58] Will: because they are doing the do
[00:08:00] Rod: they are doing the thing and, and the punching. But if you take their balls away, all they wanna do is like, write poetry and braid each other's hair.
[00:08:06] So they calm down. They calm down. That's nice. It is good. It is good. But there's, there's, there's a problem though, because it's not just because the hippos can weigh up to two tons and they really get the shits if you try and take 'em to the doctor, that's not the only problem. The other problem is also.
[00:08:22] Uh, the nuts are internal.
[00:08:24] Will: Mm-hmm.
[00:08:25] Rod: Like hippos. Don't wander around with
[00:08:27] Will: yeah. You got out
[00:08:28] Rod: Business hanging out there.
[00:08:29] Will: No. Okay. Which is
[00:08:30] Rod: is like, this is,
[00:08:31] Will: a choice of the, you know, some people ins and outs
[00:08:34] Rod: ins and outs and
[00:08:35] Will: didn't know that we, we as a species, were an Audi species
[00:08:37] Rod: We are. Which honestly I'd rather have internals.
[00:08:40] Balls are very
[00:08:40] Will: inconvenient. No, absolutely. Absolutely. If you, if you are, if you are back to the design department, you're like, you'd go,
[00:08:45] Rod: can we have on the inside, like,
[00:08:47] Will: you know, most of our organs are on the inside. Why, why, why these?
[00:08:51] Rod: let's make it really weirder to buy pants. Let's make it as difficult as possible. Particularly, and I know you're the same when we were, you know, young men, large thigh gentleman with, you know, huge, huge testic also very hard to buy pants. Okay.
[00:09:06] the hippos nuts are internal, which apparently other animals, for example, platypus, platypus.
[00:09:11] Will: Platy, puss, Platy pie,
[00:09:13] Rod: Platy pussies. Sloths and whales have internal balls.
[00:09:18] Will: Oh, no whales, of course.
[00:09:19] Rod: Can you imagine a blue whale?
[00:09:21] Will: you can't
[00:09:21] have
[00:09:21] Rod: size of blue whales
[00:09:23] Will: can't have some dangling thing out,
[00:09:25] Rod: thing like two small trucks. Like I immediately got the image and I was thinking they are inside. 'cause holy shit.
[00:09:33] Will: I think there would be more bits in Moby Dick describing the nuts. Like I feel like that would be, that would be glorious. And
[00:09:38] Rod: yo his balls. Yes. I'm sitting out here. I'm gonna describe for nine chapters.
[00:09:43] Will: Ahab got him in the
[00:09:44] Rod: ball? Slightly round, but not entirely. I drank some brackish water. There's the other ball. Anyway, so those are some creatures. Anyway, as I said earlier, they have also discreet penises, so sometimes it's not always easy to tell.
[00:09:57] Will: Yeah. Library
[00:09:57] Rod: Yeah. You can't tell if they're a boy or a girl unless you get often closer than you would
[00:10:01] Will: Oh really?
[00:10:02] Rod: Yeah. It can be a little difficult.
[00:10:03] Will: It's in the eyelashes. I think
[00:10:04] Rod: It is, yeah. They flutter ishly. We've all seen the hippo also. This is even better. Their nuts are not always in the same place from hippo to hippo.
[00:10:13] Will: they, it's just like dressing left. Dressing right.
[00:10:15] Rod: At least they roam. They move a bit around the internal cavities.
[00:10:18] Will: Somewhere near their ears.
[00:10:20] Rod: Yes. Which is why some of 'em have bulgy, uh, jaw bones. No, but they can move by a couple of
[00:10:26] Will: feet. Okay. So, so what you you're saying here is that, um, the, uh, zoo workers who have to, they have to rummage around a little bit more than you might be hoping for. Yeah. See, I thought you were gonna tell me this was like hippos, hippos, appendages were like made of iron or something like that and you had to, had to, had to get rid of them
[00:10:44] Rod: No, that's rhinos tree
[00:10:45] Will: saws or something like that.
[00:10:46] Rod: wanna be bulletproof, you want rhino hide armor.
[00:10:47] Will: Yeah. Okay. You're telling me that they're, they're wandering, they're somewhere inside and you can't find them and
[00:10:53] Rod: apparently they may retract or wiggle around during surgery.
[00:10:56] Will: Oh, they're es escape. They're
[00:10:57] Rod: They may be like Y snip, ah, you missed got my kidney. So in this study that was reported in aforementioned journal, 10 Hippo volunteers, we'll call 'em volunteers. Yeah, sure. Participants. Yeah.
[00:11:08] Will: Uh, yeah, participants, uh,
[00:11:11] Rod: um, the depth of the test he's hiding place is varied by as much as 16 inches from one hippo to the next, which is a lot.
[00:11:19] Will: Uh, if it's a bigger hippo.
[00:11:21] Rod: still a lot. I mean, our arms stay the same length and our instruments tend to
[00:11:25] Will: be Yeah, no, I get it. I get
[00:11:26] Rod: And 16 inches is what? About nine and a half
[00:11:28] Will: I feel like, I feel like, you know, you've gone with the usual spot and once you, once you've gone like 10, 12 inches beyond the usual spot, you're like, I've missed it. I've
[00:11:35] Rod: maybe it's a girl. Oh wait. Discrete penis. . Also, apparently the authors note that in the past hippopotamus or hippopotamus anesthesia has been fraught with serious complications.
[00:11:47] Will: I don't doubt it. You need a hell of a lot
[00:11:49] Rod: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's
[00:11:51] Will: like the, when they put the elephant on LSD Yeah. Um, I assume
[00:11:54] Rod: and it dies. Oh no, that's
[00:11:56] Will: it's a sad story. It did
[00:11:57] Rod: It is a sad story. But anyway, so Dean Nutting and Hippo has many challenges, it's fair to say, but it's okay because it's not entirely unlike horse not removal.
[00:12:08] So they base their model on that as the abstract said. They base it on your old, uh, your equine models of Yes. How to remove,
[00:12:14] Will: do we do it for horses again,
[00:12:16] Rod: for money
[00:12:18] Will: If
[00:12:18] Rod: if you cut off a horse's
[00:12:20] Will: they sing better or something
[00:12:21] Rod: that. Yeah. They're worth more money. They earn better. Maybe they look sexier.
[00:12:24] Will: No, no, they can't.
[00:12:25] No. Like you, you
[00:12:26] Rod: they look more
[00:12:27] Will: Stallion, he's like, I'm, I'm, I'll win some races and then I shall be breeding stock. So
[00:12:32] Rod: yeah. But then, then you got your, your geldings.
[00:12:34] Will: Yeah. Your geldings are for more pulling drafts. Are they
[00:12:37] Rod: Are they really?
[00:12:37] Will: I think so.
[00:12:38] Rod: I thought they were more so they could concentrate on the sport rather than
[00:12:42] Will: No, they don't go.
[00:12:42] Maybe they do, but No, no. Surely, surely. Maybe stallions don't, ah, shows come to a little bit of science for your
[00:12:51] Rod: for your equestrian informations.
[00:12:53] Will: Uh,
[00:12:54] Rod: yeah. If there's, if there's anything
[00:12:55] Will: But, but, you know, think about it. These are the questions that, uh, people wanna know. So,
[00:13:00] Rod: where we'll give you the question. We've got heaps of questions answers.
[00:13:02] Yeah. Next episode. So, um, what they do first, they knock them out. We don't go into the, but they've, they've found a way to knock them out without killing them or having them wake up
[00:13:10] Will: Nice. Nice.
[00:13:11] Rod: and then they ultrasound them.
[00:13:13] Will: bit headlock because put a hippo in a
[00:13:15] Rod: seriously, dude, don't let go now.
[00:13:18] Will: you need
[00:13:18] Rod: You really gotta commit.
[00:13:19] You've gotta commit, commit, commit. Eight.
[00:13:21] Will: eight ninjas sort of wrapped around a
[00:13:23] Rod: More like sumo. More like sumo.
[00:13:25] Will: probably.
[00:13:27] Rod: And then stay there. So, um, you knock 'em out, but then you ultrasound them twice first before you start cutting. Yes. And then after, after you've started to dug, dig around a bit, you go in again just in case.
[00:13:37] 'cause they've likely, they're either not what you expect or they may have moved a bit.
[00:13:41] Will: I
[00:13:42] Rod: the wandering
[00:13:43] Will: I just, the, the concept of, of any type of surgeon, animal or human wandering around looking for an organ inside, it's like, I don't know if bodies were designed for the salt search in there.
[00:13:53] Rod: so much. It's, it's weird. Darwin. Darwin fucked up there. I know. It's not his fault. So of course once they've zeroed in, it could still be tricky. 'cause by this point you basically elbows deep in hippo.
[00:14:02] Will: Indeed.
[00:14:03] Rod: And that, that's, that's a lot
[00:14:04] Will: the tool song I think. I think that's what
[00:14:06] Rod: The elbows deep in hippo.
[00:14:07] No, that was Maynard solo album.
[00:14:09] Will: Solo album.
[00:14:09] Rod: It's just 45 minutes. No words. Weird squalling. Um, they also say the authors note that grasping the testicle with forceps can be quite laborious And also they mentioned that they needed to use often a, uh, two-handed technique and moderate at traction. I'm hearing block and tackle and maybe a small
[00:14:31] Will: Yeah. We've gotta get a rope around
[00:14:32] Rod: this.
[00:14:32] Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, anyway, no surprise To remove a, a hippo's round bits takes about an hour and a half
[00:14:40] Will: Oh.
[00:14:41] Rod: anyway. How did it all go with
[00:14:42] Will: your team? I would've been surprised if you'd said less than that, to be honest.
[00:14:45] Rod: True. And I, and I do not wanna let you down.
[00:14:48] Will: Because that's the thing that matters. If anyone, if anyone like at work, listener, if anyone says, how long do you reckon it would take to castrate a hippo?
[00:14:55] You now have the number.
[00:14:56] Rod: Yeah. 15 minutes is wrong.
[00:14:58] Will: Yeah. Just tell
[00:14:58] Rod: three hours.
[00:14:59] Will: Calm down. Calm down. Yeah,
[00:15:00] exactly. What are you talking about?
[00:15:01] Rod: What kind of amateur would take three hours
[00:15:03] Will: about
[00:15:04] Rod: You gotta roll your sleeves up. So how did it all go?
[00:15:06] 10 hippos all successfully had their beanbags identified, you know, grabbed and removed. Mm-hmm. Um, but the, the recovery environment is not without its
[00:15:17] Will: Oh, okay.
[00:15:18] Rod: Because hippo spend most of their time in a pool of water packed with feces. Sure.
[00:15:23] Will: I mean,
[00:15:23] Rod: poo water
[00:15:24] Will: this like, it was the end of seven, wasn't it? You know, Brad Pitt and,
[00:15:28] Rod: what's in the box? What's in the
[00:15:30] Will: No, he sat in the pool with feces.
[00:15:31] Like did he? Yeah.
[00:15:33] Rod: I was Director's cut. No, Morgan Freeman threw him in
[00:15:36] Will: He was implied like, uh, it was
[00:15:38] Rod: it Morgan Freeman?
[00:15:39] Will: No. Morgan Freeman was the goodie. He was not, he
[00:15:41] Rod: Kevin Space
[00:15:41] Will: Morgan Freeman is never a badie.
[00:15:43] Rod: badie, isn't he?
[00:15:44] Will: No. No. It's technically impossible for
[00:15:46] Rod: Morgan. I know what I'm gonna do tonight. Dear ai. No, it's find me, Morgan Freeman is a badie or make me a God movie with him as a badie.
[00:15:53] Will: Oh, it's only if he's a vengeful God. Like that's the only, only way that, uh, Morgan,
[00:15:57] Rod: be bad 'cause he's the Lord.
[00:16:00] Will: That's
[00:16:00] Rod: just by definition
[00:16:01] Will: Like Old Testament sort of thing.
[00:16:04] Rod: Speaking of testes,
[00:16:05] Will: tears off topic there.
[00:16:07] Rod: So the hippos, they spend most of their time in pools of water packed with feces. And obviously once they've been taken out, they can't wait to get back into that goo No
[00:16:14] Will: doubt. That's their recovery technique. That's their spa.
[00:16:16] Rod: It is. It's just like, oh, thank God I can relax again as we all do.
[00:16:20] they all healed fine except for one who died very soon after the surgery, but they had some kind of an unknown but preexisting condition
[00:16:27] Will: Well, they can make more where he came
[00:16:28] Rod: Yes, they can. Well, not these 10 or nine
[00:16:30] Will: now. No, no
[00:16:31] Rod: So apparently hippos are extremely good healers and possibly this could be because of their, what they call blood sweat that oozes from them.
[00:16:38] Will: Nice.
[00:16:39] Rod: Nice. And that there was another story, which maybe I'll do one day, which talks about it being used as a, a sunscreen analog. Okay. One day
[00:16:46] Will: some hippo blood, sweat. Yeah.
[00:16:48] Rod: But to be clear, blood sweat isn't sweat and it doesn't have blood in it, but it is red. There's a pigment and it oozes outta their
[00:16:54] Will: they gonna disappoint me?
[00:16:55] Rod: me.
[00:16:56] I know When you look at, you kind of go hippo blood sweat, rub it on me. I don't want to get sunburnt. So anyway, apparently this stuff absorbs UV light and stops bacteria from growing. So it's kind of antibiotic. Not blood or sweat. So the next six months the authors would check in to see how the hippos went.
[00:17:16] So in four cases, the zoos had them fixed to calm the fuckers down. And in all four cases they're way better. Calmer, braiding hair, doing the
[00:17:26] Will: But not giving the, the zoo audiences
[00:17:29] Rod: what they want,
[00:17:29] Will: what they want, what they want.
[00:17:30] Rod: Well, a little bit though. It turns out in one of them, one of the four, the castrated male was then, oh no one, not one of the, sorry, one of the zoos.
[00:17:37] So more than one of these cases, the castrated males were getting harassed heaps more by the females once their balls had been removed. Oh. So the women are like, okay, champ,
[00:17:46] Will: I think that means calm them down
[00:17:48] Rod: watch you got mate. Yeah. Cut their ball all too late. So it's
[00:17:51] Will: other things off if you want eyelashes.
[00:17:54] Rod: Ah. So it's great. They became less aggressive, but I don't think it's nice that the um,
[00:17:59] Will: they got harassed
[00:18:00] Rod: got harassed, they got picked on.
[00:18:01] So if there's ever been a story, you should tell your next work function people. It's that one.
[00:18:07] Will: Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you so much. Hey, I promised you, um, a little bit of science communication. You did. This story, uh, it's a couple of years ago. , But it comes from, um, uh, from the George Institute in Sydney. Lovely
[00:18:20] people, George.
[00:18:20] And I just wanna, I just wanna
[00:18:21] Rod: do really good research.
[00:18:22] Will: research. They do, they do fantastic research.
[00:18:24] Rod: vital, actually saving lives as opposed to everything we've ever done.
[00:18:29] Will: Yes, yes. No, a hundred percent. A hundred percent. So, so in my critique of this, I, I like, like I, I, I wanna put on the tin lovely work.
[00:18:38] Love your work. This is all great. But I just wanted to, I just wanted to flag this study with you because, because I, I, I just thought this might, , pique your interest, . So the study kicks off with, uh, the idea that we know we being, uh, the educated world.
[00:18:52] Rod: Oh, so just you and me.
[00:18:53] Will: Sadly not you and me as we raise a beer. That alcohol ain't great for you.
[00:18:57] Rod: I am sick of seeing those studies. Sick of it. Sick of it.
[00:19:03] Will: Well, this isn't a nutty, another study telling us that alcohol isn't great for you. This is, this is a study that says working with that knowledge, not assumption, but knowledge, working with the idea that alcohol theory should be
[00:19:14] Rod: spec, hypothesis reduced,
[00:19:17] Will: how much people drink in society, how you're gonna do it.
[00:19:20] And so this is a bit
[00:19:21] Rod: I know, I know, I know, I know, I know. Don't, don't drink.
[00:19:24] Will: Yeah.
[00:19:25] Rod: the messages that either come from science, governments, whatever that just says, there is no safe level of alcohol. Like, fuck off. There's no safe level of being born. The moment you're born, you're gonna die.
[00:19:39] Will: of being
[00:19:40] Rod: you're gonna die.
[00:19:40] Will: you. You're like, you're like,
[00:19:42] Rod: gonna die.
[00:19:42] Will: You're like, teenage Buddha, like
[00:19:45] Rod: exactly. Only even less credible.
[00:19:50] Will: So freaking helpful, but yes. Yes. Uh, look, so this is why I thought you, but anyway. Um, our good friends at the George, yes. They said, okay, alright. We know that it, it would probably be good for people individually and society more broadly if we, you know, we all did a little bit less of the drinking.,
[00:20:07] , So they said, okay, there's a couple of different ways you could, you could try to do this. , And so,
[00:20:12] Rod: so threaten people or pay them?
[00:20:14] Will: Mm. Threaten people.
[00:20:16] Rod: Oh, really?
[00:20:16] Will: the George did not threaten people or pay them.
[00:20:20] Um,
[00:20:21] Rod: well, I'm out of
[00:20:21] Will: do, I do. I do. You know, just, just a, a quick word for the science communication literature. Not enough about threatening people or violence in, uh, you know, I, it doesn't turn
[00:20:30] Rod: didn't you Like all, all through my time as science, communication, academic guy, people would say, have you got any foolproof ways of doing it?
[00:20:36] I said, yeah, guns or money. Yeah. Do you have either of those? No. Well then, no, I don't have a foolproof way for you.
[00:20:40] Will: There's a, there's an exercise that I often do, like, uh, um, run a bunch of workshops with scientists, think about how they communicate the work. And we use a bunch of role playing games.
[00:20:47] Rod: We do.
[00:20:47] Will: and, and, and some stuff that we might do.
[00:20:49] You know, it's like, okay, can you explain the mobile phone? Can you, can you get a person with a broken finger? To put their finger into an x-ray machine and you know, you gotta con, you know, explain and convince the benefits, all that kind of stuff. And rarely, very rarely, I think I've had one person do it once, just grabs their hand, shoves it in the x-ray machine.
[00:21:06] It's like, well, I,
[00:21:07] Rod: It's for your own good dickhead.
[00:21:09] Will: I guess you did it,
[00:21:10] Rod: To be fair, these are people, you're explaining these to people who are like, back in the past. Yeah. They think it's witchcraft.
[00:21:16] Will: they do. I mean, if you were to give the whole context, but I just like,
[00:21:19] Rod: but that's cool. Someone just grabbed their hand and said, I'm just putting it in there.
[00:21:21] 'cause it's for your own fucking good. It's,
[00:21:23] Will: it's rare. It's rare that scientists go, violence is the way to
[00:21:27] Rod: solve. It's fair to say though, that's not communication.
[00:21:30] Will: violence is communication. Well,
[00:21:32] Rod: Oh, it's true. It, it
[00:21:33] Will: like, no, no, no
[00:21:34] Rod: is a message That's true. Violence
[00:21:36] Will: is 100% communication.
[00:21:37] Rod: someone's hand and stuffing it in an x-ray machine. Oh.
[00:21:42] Will: it, it, it is other things as well. But 100% violence is communication. It does
[00:21:46] Rod: send a message like, yeah.
[00:21:49] Will: as Dave Grabber tells us.
[00:21:51] Rod: told.
[00:21:53] Will: Oh, peace be upon him.
[00:21:55] Rod: I know. Come back. Come back.
[00:21:57] Will: So they said, all right, let's get a, let's get a bunch of adult drinkers, Australian adult drinkers, no less.
[00:22:02] Rod: Where are you gonna find those?
[00:22:04] Will: Impossible. They found 8,000 of them and they, they,
[00:22:07] Rod: How many applied? 48 million. We had to cut
[00:22:10] Will: Well, I, I dunno if they said, do you want to, do you want to drink less or do you just, do you just drink? Can you fill out a survey? Yeah. Um, and they showed them, um, a variety of why to reduce messages and how to reduce messages.
[00:22:25] Now I'm not gonna go through them all. No, I'm not gonna go through them all. 'cause I, I just want to get to, I'm. Results. So what they did, they showed them that and then, um, they then examined their drinking. They had a baseline of their drinking. You know, how many, how much do you drink per week?
[00:22:37] Self-reported? Yes, it's
[00:22:38] Rod: So all lies. Yep. Carry on.
[00:22:40] Will: but no, no self-reported. But it's self-reported in the next stage two. So,
[00:22:44] Rod: okay. So it equalizes.
[00:22:45] Will: three weeks later they did another
[00:22:47] Rod: Normally I only have two a week, now I have one and a half,
[00:22:50] Will: weeks later, another self-report. So all self-report,
[00:22:52] Rod: Yeah. Okay. Okay. At least it's consistent. It's, it's reliable, if not valid.
[00:22:56] Will: Okay. So, um, they found one method. One method was the, was the way to get people to reduce drinking. And
[00:23:04] Rod: and this was for all drinkers or particular kinds? Uh,
[00:23:07] Will: no, this is what just about general Australian adults. So adults. So they weren't dealing with teenage drinkers or
[00:23:12] Rod: or boys versus girls or whatever.
[00:23:13] Will: and, and, and look, I wanna, I wanna accept here there are, there are a million ways to try to get society to reduce drinking. This is just one sort of intervention that will get people to do
[00:23:22] Rod: it. One, yeah. One. Yeah,
[00:23:24] Will: yeah. So, so here's what it is. It causes cancer. Uh, and please count every single drink, every single time.
[00:23:34] And I'm like, oh,
[00:23:35] Rod: Oh, do you know what shits me? The only reason, other than, you know, maybe putting on an extra pound here and there around the holidays, the only thing when a few years back someone said, you know, like alcohol's been linked with cancer. I'm like, oh, would you piss off? ca of all how it's a drink?
[00:23:53] And that's the only thing
[00:23:54] Will: It's It's a drink, you mean? 'cause it's liquid. It
[00:23:56] Rod: drinks can't cause cancer. Smoking causes
[00:23:59] Will: cancer. Oh. Like you get that, like you feel like little, little things can get into you, but liquids are too big.
[00:24:04] Rod: smoke. Yeah. Too big and too, too delicious. I mean, it's just impossible. Smoking's obviously Idiotic like we drink anyway.
[00:24:10] Smoking's, idiotic and delicious as well. But you don't need to smoke. You do need to drink. No, not booze. Not booze. But
[00:24:16] Will: but no, no one has shown that wa drinking water causes cancer and I think that would be
[00:24:20] Rod: I know, but I just
[00:24:22] Will: I mean, everyone that
[00:24:23] Rod: it made me mad.
[00:24:24] Will: drunk water, so there is a correlation
[00:24:25] Rod: Holy shit. We're onto something.
[00:24:27] Will: Yeah.
[00:24:28] Rod: But no, the first time I heard, oh, you know, alcohol's been linked to, when they say cancer, I say, which ones? They go, okay, no deep breath, these 9 million cancers. I'm like, would you fuck
[00:24:37] Will: off?
[00:24:38] Rod: Would you fuck, fuck off. And to be fair though, that was the first time I went, ah, God.
[00:24:43] Will: you know what this means?
[00:24:44] Is this is like, you've gotta do a brutal campaign where it's, it's, it's like ruining everyone that's like, oh, drinking causes cancer. And then we all have to count every, each and every single drink and be, uh, tasked with that. So,
[00:24:54] Rod: uh, look, they're not wrong, but they're not right. But they're not wrong, but they're not Right. It depends what your goals are.
[00:25:03] Will: Indeed, indeed. Well, I just thought you'd like that one.
[00:25:06] Rod: I really do.
[00:25:08] Will: my impression of you is that you love getting major surgery.
[00:25:13] Rod: Look, I gotta say I am disturbingly comfortable in hospitals. Look
[00:25:20] Will: loved is maybe, maybe a challenge too far, but, uh,
[00:25:23] Rod: look, I've had one or 20, I dunno, something like that.
[00:25:26] Um, some, something. They're not all major in my defense. Not all major.
[00:25:30] Will: have you ever had, um, your heart?
[00:25:32] Rod: No. That's on the list though. I'm, I'm looking forward to it. You know, not, not according to doctors, I'm just like, well, you know, there's an organ I haven't had fiddled with or a limb so.
[00:25:41] Will: this one is a question from a listener. Uh, this is a phenomenon
[00:25:45] Rod: to me about heart surgery.
[00:25:46] Will: Yeah. Well, not to, not to you. Not to you. Not to you. This is a question that comes, uh, around the world of heart surgery because there's a phenomenon that, uh, that has been occurring to those who have not only had the heart surgery, but who have had their heart, you know, temporarily ignored, bypassed, switched off.
[00:26:09] Rod: Oh, bi That's I wild,
[00:26:10] Will: I, I feel, I, I just wanna pause for a second and, and there is something like, this is the modern medical surgery that says, all right, well, we'll just put your, all your blood going through a machine while we,
[00:26:20] Rod: put it through this shredder or fax machine or something.
[00:26:23] And it's got
[00:26:24] Will: Yeah. So look, look off machine
[00:26:26] Rod: will probably be good.
[00:26:27] Will: Coronary artery bypass graft surgery.
[00:26:30] Rod: Ooh.
[00:26:31] Will: Anything where we have the word bypass. Yeah. And coronary means that what's going on is that the blood that would normally be pumped by your heart, which we hold in western traditions and probably throughout the world as a pretty important bit for, you know, I've heard rumors.
[00:26:46] Y you're alive. Yeah. Your blood gets bypassed, gets sent through a big machine where it gets pushed through the rest of your body. Now, um,
[00:26:53] Rod: simple pub
[00:26:54] Will: key thing,
[00:26:55] Rod: you get it from any camping store.
[00:26:57] Will: I, I looked at a picture the other day and I was like, yeah, that, that looks, uh, that looks cheap. You know, looks, looks just like, no, it's a big complicated bit of equipment that, uh, make sure your blood is continuing to cycle through the rest of your body so that you are still alive
[00:27:10] Rod: the right pressure as well.
[00:27:12] Will: Indeed. While you're on the table. While you're on the table. And, and look, I, I've just gotta say, this is not a history of the heart bypass, but just to pause for a second and recognize the, the miracle of going, all right, we need to operate with an organ that does something important every single second of your life? Yeah.
[00:27:29] Rod: yeah, yeah,
[00:27:29] Will: how do you do that? Okay. We we're gonna make a big machine that can take your blood and do
[00:27:33] Rod: we'll just take it outta the loop.
[00:27:35] Will: it's, it's wild.
[00:27:36] Like,
[00:27:36] Rod: in incre and it's not recent, like
[00:27:38] Will: No, no, it's not. But it's still, it's still of the 20th century that, you know, so many other organs we can sort of go. All right. Your stomach, we can probably play around in
[00:27:46] Rod: that. You can live without one. We did a story on this, like, you can live without a fucking stomach.
[00:27:51] How can that be?
[00:27:52] Will: Or your brain? We don't even need to turn it off. We can, we can, we will keep you awake and we'll prod some bits in there, but, uh,
[00:27:58] Rod: God. I don't want that surgery.
[00:27:59] Will: I'm, I am. I don't want it. But if I have to have it, I'm 100% down to be there.
[00:28:04] Rod: I'd wanna be sus sedate. I'd have to be off my tits
[00:28:07] Will: No, no, no, no, no, no. I, I, I am so keen for someone to touch my brain.
[00:28:11] Rod: what you're forgetting though? To get there you have to smell your own bone being cut.
[00:28:16] Will: No, that's, um, that's burning.
[00:28:18] Rod: If you think concrete soaring smells
[00:28:19] Will: no, no. I know, I know. The smell of bo smell of bone is, is No,
[00:28:22] Rod: no, no.
[00:28:23] Your bone. Which bone? Oh, the skull.
[00:28:26] Will: No, again, again, I'm with
[00:28:28] Rod: That noise.
[00:28:29] Will: Oh, yeah. A whole bunch of crepitus too.
[00:28:31] Like I, I, I appreciate that. I appreciate, all I'm saying is I'm gonna, I'm a silver lining guy without
[00:28:37] Rod: Yeah. Ignoring all that. Yes. I'm a silver lining guy. You are.
[00:28:40] Will: You are. And it's like,
[00:28:41] Rod: you're an upbeat
[00:28:41] Will: this has to happen. So can't wait for someone to touch my brain. Let's get into, put your finger in my brain.
[00:28:46] Rod: Make me feel whatever
[00:28:48] Will: to see.
[00:28:48] Give me red, come on. Make me, you know, holy
[00:28:50] Rod: shit. Suddenly I'm a Nazi. Now I'm not. Now I'm like, I dunno. I feel like I'm royalty. How
[00:28:54] Will: you not, how would you not go? Okay. Poke a bunch of places and just see what happens. Like,
[00:28:58] Rod: as long as it's revocable.
[00:29:01] Will: Yeah, indeed, indeed.
[00:29:02] But, but, but the heart, it, it is, it is. You know, we rely on a heart all the time and to, and, and it is a miracle.
[00:29:09] It is a miracle, yeah. But. There's an interesting phenomenon when, uh, when, uh, your patients go into some sort of, uh, a heart bypass surgery. Yeah. that for the next few months afterwards months. Months, they're significantly dumber. You, you wouldn't know. You wouldn't, you wouldn't know.
[00:29:34] Rod: reckon. I reckon you would.
[00:29:35] Will: Well, okay. They know they
[00:29:37] Rod: how, how my pants work.
[00:29:39] Will: Hi.
[00:29:39] Rod: Heart. Good.
[00:29:40] Will: So here's the, here's I'm gonna read, I'm gonna read a bunch of little bits from, um, an abstract of a paper because the paper gives, gives.
[00:29:46] Rod: this is, is this, is this new?
[00:29:48] This is only recently.
[00:29:50] Will: okay, it's called Pump Brain or Pump Head.
[00:29:52] so basically you go for, you go for open heart surgery and you, you come out and you can do cognitive tests and you are solidly dumber if you've been on the pump
[00:30:01] Rod: what is it, person, human, piano, chair, or all
[00:30:03] Will: of those things. Yeah. Yeah. You do the trade. And so,
[00:30:06] Rod: that is just bizarre.
[00:30:09] Will: Just bizarre.
[00:30:09] And, and there's a bit where you hear, you're on a pump. Why would you be dumber afterwards? Like, you're not touching the brain, you're not like, is it? So actually, actually, I want do come with, let's go with some theories at the
[00:30:21] Rod: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
[00:30:22] Will: on? I'll, I'll give you some stats that help to explain what's going on.
[00:30:26] it's been seen by, um, uh, people that have gone through, uh, uh, any, any sort of heart bypass surgery. Um, uh, and it's been known for a while. So I'm gonna quote from a, a study that happened at the end of the 20th century, 1998 to 2000, in the Netherlands, where, and here's, here's where there's a part of me that's like, did you need to do this?
[00:30:48] Rod: It's always our Dutch cousins, they're very, they're, they're very inquisitive.
[00:30:51] Will: Well, they did a randomized control trial.
[00:30:54] Rod: so let's grab people off
[00:30:55] Will: the, this is where I'm like, heart bypass surgery and randomized controlled trial. What are you doing? So,
[00:31:02] Rod: so, Hank, come over here. We're just going to bypass your heart briefly. We want see why.
[00:31:08] We wanna see if you get stupid then. Okay.
[00:31:12] Will: For sights
[00:31:13] Rod: it's for shy, I'm up for it.
[00:31:16] Will: This, this is, okay. So patients scheduled for their first, uh, coronary artery bypass graft. Yeah. Um, they're, they're older people. 61. Uh, were randomly signed to off pump surgery. On pump surgery. And I'm like, no. Why? I don't want to be, I wanna be assigned to the best
[00:31:36] Rod: one that I need.
[00:31:37] Will: the,
[00:31:38] Rod: And
[00:31:38] Will: I don't wanna be randomly assigned.
[00:31:40] Rod: to satisfy your curiosity about stupidity post pump. That's horrifying.
[00:31:45] Will: This, this is why I had under the title for this. Was that necessary?
[00:31:50] Rod: I'm not signing up for that.
[00:31:54] Will: Cognitive outcome was measured at, at three and 12 months and, you know, they got a bunch of psychologists involved. Sure. The psychologists excellently were blinded for randomization. Of course.
[00:32:03] Rod: blinded the psychologist.
[00:32:04] Will: indeed. Uh, and then administered 10 neuropsychological tests before and after surgery. So, you know, uh, they, they also measured a bunch of other things, quality of life, stroke rate, or course mortality. Yeah.
[00:32:15] Rod: attitude to the other genders.
[00:32:17] Will: yeah, yeah. Yeah. And so, you know this, I just wanna pause.
[00:32:21] I get a. We could go, why are people dumber after hearts open? Uh, having the heart pump. Sure. But to go, let's randomly assign half of them.
[00:32:34] Rod: Look, they're a, uh, they're, yeah. As I say, they're in inquisitive people.
[00:32:37] Will: They're an inquisitive people. Cognitive decline, um, could be determined in all of the patients at three
[00:32:45] Rod: months.
[00:32:45] Will: All all, but, but, but
[00:32:47] Rod: after the pump, patients,
[00:32:50] Will: small difference. Uh,
[00:32:51] Rod: Uh,
[00:32:52] Will: more so in the on pump, it's like 29% in the pump people versus the, um, on pump.
[00:32:58] And that was statistically significant. Overall there does seem to be that the people who put through the pump. We're a bit dumber after, you know, at the three month mark, but at the 12 month mark, it, it all evened out. So don't worry. If you are getting, if you are getting, uh, heart surgery with a pump, you'll be smart again after
[00:33:15] Rod: 12 months in Amsterdam.
[00:33:16] In
[00:33:16] Will: in Amsterdam.
[00:33:17] In Amsterdam, yes, you'll be, you'll be smart again after 12 months. But at three months, you're a little bit dumber than the people who were off the pump, patients who received their first CABG surgery without bypass.
[00:33:29] Rod: mm-hmm.
[00:33:30] Will: um, had improved cognitive outcomes three months after the procedure, but the effects were limited and became negligible at 12 months.
[00:33:36] So don't worry, it all comes back, but something's going on that in that first through period.
[00:33:41] Rod: what the
[00:33:43] Will: So I want, I want you to speculate what, what, I mean, I've, I've seen a bunch of theories what this could be
[00:33:49] Rod: versus off the pump.
[00:33:51] Will: they reckon it could be some microbes.
[00:33:53] Rod: Uh oh, like
[00:33:54] Will: The, the, the other one they said it could be the stress of the hospital.
[00:33:58] You know, you know, there's a bunch of tests. You know, you put a bunch of people in a
[00:34:00] Rod: hospital Sure.
[00:34:01] Will: Sure. Instantly their blood pressure rises, their anxiety
[00:34:03] Rod: Sure.
[00:34:04] Will: Sure. It's, you know, I think there was a study years ago, you put people in a bikini and they, they do less, less Well in an IQ test
[00:34:10] Rod: totally would. 'cause I'd be too busy going, fuck, I look good in
[00:34:12] Will: know, right? I know. That's all I'm thinking. But, so, so it could be situational things, but it's hard to know why,
[00:34:20] Rod: know, what I, okay. The,
[00:34:20] Will: do that. 'cause you're, you're knocked out. Like there is no, I don't think
[00:34:23] Rod: here's what I wonder. The, the one thing I wonder is what we're terrible at, we do our best, but bodies, our circulatory systems, all our other systems, they have irregularity to them, but it is not like a machine.
[00:34:34] Will: That's the bit that I
[00:34:35] thought. Is there something else going on in here that, um,
[00:34:38] Rod: Our systems don't, like, we don't have perfect or, or absolutely. Stable blood pressure from second to second, pretty much.
[00:34:45] Will: And
[00:34:45] Rod: there, for example, there is,
[00:34:46] Will: there is, there is. I mean, there's, there's brain cells. Well, neurons we know in the heart.
[00:34:51] Rod: within and And within the tumtum.
[00:34:52] Will: And within the tum indeed. And so there's probably some sort of communication effect. There's probably some sort of pressure and flow and blood pumping that if you go to a consistent pressure of a machine.
[00:35:02] Rod: yeah, yeah. Um, that
[00:35:03] Will: maybe something, I mean, it's so weird. It's, so
[00:35:06] Rod: I wanna know more.
[00:35:07] Will: it does say to me, something interesting is happening in the flow of blood in your body.
[00:35:12] So, so this,
[00:35:13] Rod: Yeah, this could reveal like unexpected things about other stuff, which I think is very
[00:35:17] Will: clear. I think that's the reason, that's the reason why it's actually legit to do the study. 'cause I think
[00:35:21] Rod: particularly if it's not on me,
[00:35:22] Will: like why, why is this happening? Is more than, it's not, it's not just a sort of hospital effect.
[00:35:28] No, it's, it's something going on that's like blood, blood and brain and, and, and so it's kind of, kind of, did you really need to ask that question? But I'm interested in the answer.
[00:35:37] Rod: Thanks for doing so. And you proud Dutch volunteers? We salute you.
[00:35:42] Will: No, they weren't either. They were, they were the
[00:35:45] Rod: So it's early 2020s. A patient turns up at a hospital US, I believe, after five days of, um, quite extreme testicular pain. After a little examination and they considered the symptoms, it was clear that he was suffering from rect, uh, rectal urethral fistula.
[00:36:01] Will: Again,
[00:36:02] Rod: a recor, urethral fistula,
[00:36:04] Will: a hole somewhere in the
[00:36:06] Rod: in the vicinity of the, the, the pants trousers.
[00:36:10] Will: This is obviously when, you know, you've chosen door number three and door number one and two are cars, and door number three is a rec urethra. Fistula.
[00:36:19] Rod: Yeah. The, the, the random
[00:36:21] Will: I, I don't think anyone is choosing that.
[00:36:22] Rod: So this is an extremely rare condition where there is, as you picked a new anatomical connection between the urethra and the rectum.
[00:36:29] it's usually caused by other conditions like prostate cancer, rectal cancer, surgeries in the vicinity, severe traumas, et cetera. And the study does mention that there are a large number of cases of this sort of thing during times of war. Just a little aside, I assume. 'cause they're working quickly with terrible things.
[00:36:47] So unpacking a bit further in hospitals, it's very common to use a Foley catheter, which is a flexible tube you use to drain urine in people who, you know, too impaired to get up and pee or have a significant damage in the whole area. Pelvic vicular region. Yeah. Official term. And sometimes the use of those, the removal, the insertion, whatever, can lead to complications.
[00:37:08] Will: sure.
[00:37:09] Rod: So given the nature in the region of his complaints, the testicular stuff, the doctor said, look, have you had, uh, any abdominal surgeries, rectal manipulation and penetration, or rectal trauma? And at first Man said.
[00:37:23] Will: no. Mm-hmm.
[00:37:24] Rod: I, I did not, but it soon came out the two years earlier.
[00:37:27] he'd spent three weeks in a coma 'cause he had a bad combination of cocaine and PCP angel dust.
[00:37:33] Sure. Which fucked him up. Put him in a coma. Put him in a coma.
[00:37:36] Will: I just have to No, I, I'm not confessing here that that was me. But, um, you know, if,
[00:37:42] Rod: I thought I would get you to
[00:37:43] Will: No, but, but, but, but the guy, you know, having a night out that goes to two weeks in a coma, it's, it's, it's certainly not great. But also you don't hear those stories very often.
[00:37:53] Rod: Three weeks in a coma.
[00:37:55] Will: Sure. Sure. Like, I, I like the idea that someone's like, well, I was in a coma for two weeks after that and it's like, well, whatever man. I was three weeks Really?
[00:38:03] Rod: What did you have Bad cocaine? Like I had PCP as well, so it didn't go well.
[00:38:09] And um, I, I assume he didn't say yes, I've had something happen because he was maybe a bit embarrassed or whatever. But anyway, he probably had a Foley catheter and it probably caused some significant damage in the
[00:38:20] Will: area,
[00:38:20] Rod: paricular region, especially the, an anatomical connection between urethra and rectum.
[00:38:25] Now, the reason this caught my eye was not what I've told you so far, because obviously the term rectal urethral fistula is alluring to me. How could it not be? Mm-hmm.
[00:38:35] Will: Mm-hmm.
[00:38:36] Rod: But the five days of testicular pain, which obviously horrifying, it's not particularly noteworthy for this highbrow show. I'll tell you what was,
[00:38:44] Will: it
[00:38:45] Rod: an ongoing symptom he lived with before the testicular pain moved him to seek help. He had been experiencing. a substantial amount of sperm passage from his rectum with ejaculation. Wow. For the past two years. Wow.
[00:38:59] Will: Wow. Wow, wow. When, when? Um,
[00:39:02] Rod: two years.
[00:39:03] Will: I mean, I know, I know. You don't necessarily, A lot of people have something go wrong in their body and they don't go to the doctor straight away because it's like, oh, maybe there was a one off, or you know, you forget or something like that.
[00:39:13] And, and when do you go to the doctor and say, look, doc,
[00:39:16] Rod: coming out my bum.
[00:39:17] Will: Indeed, indeed.
[00:39:18] Rod: I'm coming out my bum
[00:39:19] Will: indeed.
[00:39:20] Rod: for two years now, I don't have any details on whether that was self-gratification with a partner, whatever, but
[00:39:27] Will: doesn't matter.
[00:39:27] Rod: He would ejaculate and it would come out his date.
[00:39:30] So the suspicion was the catheter that was in there caused this enduring hole, your rector urethral fistula that redirected some fluids. Um, I don't understand why it took two years for him to come and say,
[00:39:44] Will: no, I
[00:39:45] Rod: no, I, I have an issue.
[00:39:46] Will: I think, you know, I haven't actually done the story, but, you know, embarrassment is, is a significant
[00:39:52] Rod: force. It's a, it's a potent
[00:39:53] Will: you know, I I, let's say 99% of deaths are caused, they're not, but, but a lot, a lot of
[00:39:59] Rod: You're right. You idiot. 92
[00:40:01] Will: embarrassment is high. Like if you were
[00:40:03] Rod: oh, it would be enormous. The number of times I've gone to doctors for things where I've said, you know what? I don't wanna be the idiot who didn't do this.
[00:40:10] Will: you are, you're actually wise on this. Uh, no, no. So I, I can, you know, next to embarrassment is laziness and,
[00:40:16] Rod: Yeah, it's true.
[00:40:17] Or,
[00:40:17] Will: or, or here's, here's my, my problem. Yeah. Rank optimism.
[00:40:23] You
[00:40:24] Rod: you do have a problem with optimism.
[00:40:25] Will: You know, there's, you're
[00:40:26] Rod: too good at it.
[00:40:26] Will: Yeah. You know where you go, well actually maybe this is the start of a superpower, or
[00:40:32] Rod: it, I'm numb from the lips down. That could be awesome. 'cause I don't feel pain. That's gotta be good.
[00:40:40] Will: So there you go.
[00:40:40] Rod: go. You do, you do, you do have impressive optimism. It's true. That may be the top of your list actually. How you feeling?
[00:40:47] Will: Embarrassment.
[00:40:48] Rod: good. But it's gonna be great. It's gonna be great In
[00:40:49] Will: Over weening optimism. There you go.
[00:40:51] Rod: I don't have any of that. I ha I have the, my biggest embarrassment would be I didn't come to you, and then the doc
[00:40:58] Will: now, now that
[00:40:58] Rod: know what, if you'd come to me sooner, you wouldn't be dying in two
[00:41:01] Will: much. And that would be so embarrassing.
[00:41:02] Rod: It would be, it actually would be
[00:41:04] Will: be like, oh. But, but yeah. Okay. So, so then I'm just, I,
[00:41:08] Rod: I, I'm, I'm sure because if it wasn't causing him pain, et cetera, and he's like, well, I can still
[00:41:12] Will: and it's just a thing.
[00:41:13] Rod: I can still come and stuff. I'm not trying to have a
[00:41:15] Will: who wants to see my party trick? Like,
[00:41:17] Rod: Exactly. It's very clo alike too. If you really wanna have a baby babe, we're gonna have to press different parts
[00:41:22] Will: together.
[00:41:23] Yeah. It's, it's, you gotta do front and back, like you need a bit of each. Yeah.
[00:41:25] Rod: Yeah. I need the front to go Well, and I need the back for the actual delivery.
[00:41:30] Will: Or you should see if this is the first baby done by immaculate
[00:41:34] Rod: something, it's not really immaculate.
[00:41:38] I mean Im, that's it's doing a lot heavy your lifting,
[00:41:41] Will: I mean, in the biblical sense, like.
[00:41:44] Rod: is it? No, I don't think this is in the Bible. I haven't read it all.
[00:41:48] Will: And then
[00:41:49] Rod: I got to page 9,000 and
[00:41:50] Will: and then Joseph, Joseph did a bit out of his bu
[00:41:53] Rod: bum did bum juice. While praying. So this poor man, the doctors found the hole, they sealed it, and he did have to get a temporary catheter while he was healing, which I imagine would be the most careful catheter insertion ever.
[00:42:11] Sure. Given what happened to him, but he made apparently a full recovery. Wonderful. So if you're gonna share this story anyway, I'm thinking share it with your children or your church elders. I think these are the, this is the best place to share, share this story. Just offering advice.
[00:42:28] Will: I'm, uh, I'm just gonna
[00:42:31] Rod: rock quietly in the corner.
[00:42:32] Will: corner. Yeah. I'm just gonna rock quietly in the corner. Actually, actually, I did have, um, um, I just wanted to, I just wanted to give you this, this one as a, as a, as a send off at the end here. Thank you. If you've made the biggest discovery in in your life. Yeah.
[00:42:46] How do you dress when you turn up? Because I've got a, um, a picture here of a guy he discovered an awesome spinosaurus.
[00:42:53] Rod: he did. And
[00:42:53] Will: he, he wore his tank top. And I'm like, good on, like, and I just came dressed like dress
[00:42:59] Rod: This is reverse sexism. 'cause a woman in a sleeveless top, in a, in a informal environment would looked totally normal.
[00:43:04] A dude, however,
[00:43:06] Will: dressed for the job that you want, paleontologist Paul Sereno, uh, with a reconstructed spinosaurus ous skull. The skull looks fricking awesome. And you look awesome too. Paul, you'll, you
[00:43:16] Rod: You got your tanky and your beads. I applaud both. I applaud both.
[00:43:18] Will: Uh, a little bit of science is the science show for you and your friends.
[00:43:22] Give it to your friends.
[00:43:23] Rod: Yeah, give it to all your friends. Um, and give it to us too at Cheers at a little bit of science.com au slash Jesus.
[00:43:31] Will: Not slash Jesus.
